What's your relashionship with Java?

[ephemera]

What's your relashionship with Java?

Love to hear your comments, experience with Java, its's pro's and con's ... almost anything except flaming. :)

[BSDfan666]

No flaming? but that's the best kind of comments. :)

My not so ephemera-approved flame: Boo! Java! :(

[TerryP]

Hmm, Java ....


Design wise I like Java very much. Relationship wise? Ehhh I don't think I can actually say that here... haha.


I'm mostly indifferent to the question of single or multiple inheritance -> I just don't care. So that part of Java doesn't really effect me, I however love Javas interfaces quite a lot. Maybe because I'm not a big OOP man, I really like the idea of a "you implement the entire interface or I'll spit on your grave" concept in Java.



To me, OOP is just one syntactic way of doing the right thing not a requirement for good design.



I think Java is a very fine language but I don't actually like to write in it !!!




IEspeciallyHateLongNames likeThis = new IEspeciallyHateLongNames(KillTheCoderNow);

WhenThis is = new WhenThis(asReadable);





The former is how to much of the Java code I've read looks (without to many exaggerations) and I find it aesthetically 'annoying' to say the least...

Especially if they pump the code full of thick identifiers that will go out of scope a few lines later and are barely used, just because they can use up 70-90% of a line for nothing.



How Java handles exceptions, I dislike having to work with it but feel it is better then the alternatives.


Things that I generally dislike about Java? Probably occasional javac'isms that are not necessarily part of Java but make their way into tools for it and become general facts of life with the language.


Not to mention how long it can take to compile or start some Java apps compared to doing similar stuff via Python or C++.


Maybe using a lot of scripting languages out of lack of time and having 2GB of RAM on one machine has made me less of a patient person about waiting on programs to become usable.

[Carpetsmoker]

The fact that I need a dual core and 2 GB RAM just to execute a small script kind of stops me from using Java...

[revzalot]

Scripting is all I need.

[ai-danno]

What's my relationship to Java? I don't have a formal relationship with Java, she's just a little thing on the side... Perl's my real gal ;)

Sorry... couldn't resist.

[TerryP]

*high fives ai-danno*

[horizon]

I did Java in university and it wasn't all that bad. It's very easy to hack together a working application rather quickly. However having used many Java-written applications over the years I've grown to detest how pathetically slow and buggy it is. Hopefully this will start to change now it's truely open, but I still think anything of any importance should have more time invested in it and should be written in C or C++.

[lvlamb]

Hate it as much as I hate paying taxes. Have to live with it.

[richardpl]

I ignore Java as much as I can ...
It have same nice pros but currently too much cons for me.

[ocicat]

What's your relashionship with Java?
While I'm not overly enthralled with Java's verbosity, I have found OpenGrok (http://opensolaris.org/os/project/opengrok/) (a Java application...) to be a very useful code browser. The NetBSD project has set up a sanctioned server themselves, & independent servers have been set up for some of the other projects:

OpenBSD: http://opengrok.creo.hu/openbsd/
NetBSD: http://opengrok.netbsd.org/source/
DragonFlyBSD: http://opengrok.creo.hu/dragonfly/

Sorry FreeBSD folks, I thought I remembered a OpenGrok server set up for the FreeBSD source base, but either the server is no longer available, or my memory is faulty. :o

[ephemera]

i recall having read about opengrok long time back (http://www.opensolaris.org/os/project/opengrok/manual/story/) but never really tried it out and it eventually slipped my mind.
thanks to Ocicat for bringing this up. It looks good, i will check it out.

also, groked source code for BSD on the web is a very useful resource. pity freebsd is missing/unknown but i guess one can easily create it on their own computer.

[Sunnz]

Err what relationship? :p

I don't particularly hate it, I don't mind to use it neither...

[ephemera]

Err what relationship? :p

I don't particularly hate it, I don't mind to use it neither...
Sorry, I forgot to add the "tepid" option.

[roddierod]

I hate Java so much that I once re-wrote an existing Java web application in Delphi!!

[ephemera]

i hate java so much that i once re-wrote an existing java web application in delphi!!
lol .

[anomie]

I avoid java like I avoid Jack in the Box.

Unfortunately, I need to use a proprietary java application to encrypt my connection to my employer's mainframe; this means I have a JRE installed on my workstations.

I also occasionally get called on to write add-on java applications for our proprietary Business Intelligence suite (which provides a nasty, poorly documented SDK).

[deemon]

I generally dislike java applications and programming in java.
Applications tend to feel heavy and slowish even with todays superior hardware.
Java code is too verbose and I often hit various java quirks while programming (which isn't very often).
Though - java has been useful in couple of cases where multiplatform gui applications were needed.

[JMJ_coder]

Hello,

I can't really say, yet. I'm taking the required Java course this fall at the university. But, I can say from a users point of view that I don't like Java programs. They always seem to be so slow - especially at startup - and very temperamental. The way Java plays out for me as a user has always been a turn off for me to learn it (but I don't have a choice at the university).

[thejosephgrace]

I didn't used to like Java at all because of it's closed nature, so I'm not that well educated about it. However now that the OpenJDK has been released, I'm actually pretty excited for where Java is going. I may even see if I can try to learn it.
P.S. FLOSS recently had a great interview with the guys that were the driving force behind the OpenJDK. http://twit.tv/floss33

[ohauer]

I didn't used to like Java at all because of it's closed nature

Hm, the source was aviable (except the bootstap)

Maybe i'm outing me now, but i work in a java house (and i have running many web applications with java running since FreeBSD 5.2).

I agree with the dislike of every new tool that comes now with a java gui and support for only one platform (backup, clientless vpn... for windows) but that's another story.

All I can say is a well developed 'enterprise java' app can run fine and quick even on a old 600MHz machine with 512MB ram (deploy time not counted)

[stukov]

I agree with ohauer. It is not because there are slow application writtent in Java that Java in necessarily slow. There are slow C application even if C is recognized to be fast.

I had to wrote a few applications in Java at school and loved my experience. I feel this language is pretty complete, as it allows you to write low-level applications as well as high-level application quickly. Yes there are a bunch of methods, but who forces you to use them?

[corey_dump]

I had to help someone through a Java class once. I had never done it myself, and the pupil wasn't cut out to be a programmer -- she dropped CS shortly thereafter (yes, she was female, but it had nothing to do with her gender).

Anyway, I remember not feeling comfortable with the language. I was flipping back and forth through her textbook to do things that, while flipping, I had already figured out how to do in 3 or 4 other languages. It was quite frustrating (and exacerbated by the fact that she usually waited until the last minute for help, and was on the 2pm-2am college student schedule, while I was working a 7-5 job).

But since I generally form judgments about languages within the first hour or so's use of them or reading about them, Java failed my test. Maybe I didn't give it a fair shake, but I never used it or wanted to use it after that. Now that it has some worthy competition, I probably won't ever use it.

I have used some nice programs written in Java, though, and it can be reasonably fast. Obviously it fits someone's mental model, just not mine.

[ephemera]

> Now that it has some worthy competition

(you forgot to mention) which language?

[prijikn]

No Java for me, thank you.

[fridder]

JAVA=UGH! but is better than C#. For both I simply hate being beaten over the head with OOP. I like OOP, but the way Python approaches seems much less heavy handed. Couple that with having to deal with type declarations and all that(yes I got spoiled by scripts) and I would rather code in C++ than JAVA. The one plus is the open nature and plethora of libraries.

[vigol]

Deitel's were anticipate an elegant future for java -- C How to Program 3rd ed. --, but I'm in opposite line, And I think OpenJDK is a proof! in the same way that OpenSolaris is a proof.
And in a footnote manner : MySQL is joing to this theory draft too.